Breathing some new life into old characters.

Lew Stringer · Post by **Lew Stringer** » 27 Sep 2006, 22:40

David McDonald wrote:One title that would work, if someone at egmont would be interested in doing it is an 2000ad Exterme Edition type reprint .
They could do it in the same format as the Exterme Edition (here after EE!)and slip it into the same schedual as EE, coming out on the alternative quarter that EE dosent come out.
Have featured in it stories from Scream, Action, Battle, etc basically anything that could be soldand be of interest to the 2000ad market.

Any thoughts?

David

There was a comic like that several years ago. Can't remember its title now (something with Action in I think) but it reprinted some of the tamer strips from Action etc.

They also did a Johnny Cougar reprint comic of all things! Lasted about 6 issues unsurprisingly.

At present, Egmont UK are happy to concentrate on magazines and children's books. They don't seem to think there's a market for comics as such.

Lew

David McDonald · Post by **David McDonald** » 27 Sep 2006, 23:01

All Action Monthly,late eighties I believe, and not very good. Not much of a market for Martins Marvellous Mini!!!!

I know egmont probably will never do it, But Wagner and Grant did so much work for IPC, like The Thirtheenth Floor and the like of major Easy from Battle drawn by Ezquerra, that it would be easy to pitch these stories at 2000ad readers given the ties that are there.

It would only really work if Egmont did it as they wouldnt have to buy a licence for the material reducing their overheads considerably.

David

David McDonald · Post by **David McDonald** » 27 Sep 2006, 23:02

All Action Monthly,late eighties I believe, and not very good. Not much of a market for Martins Marvellous Mini!!!!

I know egmont probably will never do it, But Wagner and Grant did so much work for IPC, like The Thirtheenth Floor and the like of major Easy from Battle drawn by Ezquerra, that it would be easy to pitch these stories at 2000ad readers given the ties that are there.

It would only really work if Egmont did it as they wouldnt have to buy a licence for the material reducing their overheads considerably.

David

Lew Stringer · Post by **Lew Stringer** » 28 Sep 2006, 09:58

David McDonald wrote:All Action Monthly,late eighties I believe, and not very good. Not much of a market for Martins Marvellous Mini!!!!

I know egmont probably will never do it, But Wagner and Grant did so much work for IPC, like The Thirtheenth Floor and the like of major Easy from Battle drawn by Ezquerra, that it would be easy to pitch these stories at 2000ad readers given the ties that are there.

It would only really work if Egmont did it as they wouldnt have to buy a licence for the material reducing their overheads considerably.

David

Sadly the fact they sold off 2000AD, Judge Dredd and all associated characters to Rebellion suggests it's unlikely they'll do an adventure comic, reprint or otherwise, in the near future.

Lew

kevf · Post by **kevf** » 28 Sep 2006, 10:31

For myself, and talking for "my" readers (ie the sort of kids I meet in schools who read The Beano and are my dream target audience) I don't want to see reprints of old material when there's a more likely market for new material featuring those characters.

I agree that an established brand helps sell a title, so I'm not averse to people taking old characters by the scruff of the neck and breathing new life into them. But reprinting old strips, which DC Thomson does more than enough of every Christmas, doesn't excite me.

A good Desperate Dan graphic novel, 96 pages by Grant Morrison and Frank Quitely. Now THAT would be worth seeing.

Kev F

chrissmillie · Post by **chrissmillie** » 28 Sep 2006, 11:05

Never heard of that All-Action comic. It's a good idea but I think too expensive to produce. Virtually no profit whatsoever by my calculations, if you charge a reasonable price. Otherwise, I'd be very interested.

As most of you know, Spitfire Comics has the Hookjaw collection out soon. If successful, I would be looking to produce other graphic novels, such as Best of Buster with the Leopard, Galaxus, Faceache etc, or a Best of Battle (Fighting Mann, Johnny Red etc). I think that's more the way forward.

And I'd always welcome investors, either in money or skills.

Lew Stringer · Post by **Lew Stringer** » 28 Sep 2006, 11:28

chrissmillie wrote: As most of you know, Spitfire Comics has the Hookjaw collection out soon. If successful, I would be looking to produce other graphic novels, such as Best of Buster with the Leopard, Galaxus, Faceache etc, or a Best of Battle (Fighting Mann, Johnny Red etc). I think that's more the way forward.

And I'd always welcome investors, either in money or skills.

I have to agree with Kev that if publishers are going to invest in something then I too would rather see new material than reprint. Of the strips mentioned so far that people here would like to see reprinted, all seem to be from their own childhoods. Are we perhaps being a bit selfish? I don't see anyone suggesting a collection of Roy Wilson's work, or the Complete Weary Willie and Tired Tim. Mainly because they're "before our time" and perhaps we don't think they're a viable prospect to sell?

I love the sixties Odhams comics but looking at them objectively a lot of the material wasn't that good outside of Ken Reid, Leo Baxendale, Mike Higgs, Graham Allen and a few others.

The sad fact is that a lot of todays kids will consider the strips we grew up on to be as dated as we might consider Edwardian comics to be. (As Egmont discovered when they put 7 year old reprints in Buster and Whizzer & Chips.) While we, as fans and collectors, might want to see comics heritage preserved, and would support such projects, the average reader would prefer to see modern material.

Lew

chrissmillie · Post by **chrissmillie** » 28 Sep 2006, 11:49

But there's plenty of new material out there. Marvel doesn't give up on Essential Fantastic Four with the Galactus Trilogy because there's a new Ms Marvel comic out. So why should British comics?

I suspect there's no move to produce Weary Willy and Tired Tim because there's no market. Charley's War however sold very well, as do Dan Dare, Modesty Blaise etc, suggesting there is a market for classic British adventure comics from the 60s/70s.

(Oh and I do produce new comics and reprint Golden Age stories on the Starscape website. I'd particularly recommend all-new Guard Dogs by Jason 'Commando/Spider-Man/Action Man' Quinn and John 'TV 21/Action/Flash Gordon' Britton - updated this weekend!) (actually this sounds as though I'm quite angry but I'm not - just the way things sometimes lose their meaning on paper).

Chris

Lew Stringer · Post by **Lew Stringer** » 28 Sep 2006, 12:03

chrissmillie wrote:But there's plenty of new material out there. Marvel doesn't give up on Essential Fantastic Four with the Galactus Trilogy because there's a new Ms Marvel comic out. So why should British comics?

I suspect there's no move to produce Weary Willy and Tired Tim because there's no market. Charley's War however sold very well, as do Dan Dare, Modesty Blaise etc, suggesting there is a market for classic British adventure comics from the 60s/70s.

I'm sure there is a market for the cream of the crop. (And even looking at them objectively I don't think anyone could deny that Dan Dare and Modesty Blaise are top standard strips.) But I'm not convinced that reprints from Scream could sell. As I said, we agree there's no market for a Weary Willie and Tired Tim collection because we see them as too dated. I think kids would consider most sixties/ seventies/ eighties strips in the same way. Nostalgia gives us rose tinted specs sometimes.

Lew

Cap Haggis · Post by **Cap Haggis** » 28 Sep 2006, 12:23

I have to agree with Lew, there simply is no MAINSTREAM market out there for the old 60s - 70s, 80s strips its time to let that dream go - that sort of material I woud suggest has a valid (and perhaps eventually profitable) place in specialist book publishers (such as Spitefire ) but for a mainstream book that audience is very small and dwindling. Marvel and DC etc have a much larger fan base interested in old strips plus these characters are still going stong (via comics, cartoons , films etc) so there will always be some interest in them plus the art and writing on soem of these old USA strips is excelelnt (whether UK fans want ot accept that or not) - who remembers Wilson, ALf Tupper, Sarge,Cap Hurrican in todays audience withthe stilted old artwork and old fashioned writing - very few - As Kevs says enough old reprints (outwith the Spitfire type thing which I have no problem with and will be purchasing Hookjaw as its a great idea) how about some exciting new work , even if it is featuring old characters with a twist? We do need a new 2000AD with that new talent which is out there, jus tlook at the fanzine and small press market some great artists writers that deserve a chance

chrissmillie · Post by **chrissmillie** » 28 Sep 2006, 12:31

By that token, surely you'd say minor characters from 2000AD (Button Man or Shako) have no appeal, or dated strips like Commando or Classics from the Comics.

There's also who you think the mainstream market is. Kids? Not for 2000AD, Marvel etc. Most of them are in their 30s.

And I'll say again, there are masses of new comics produced. Doesn't mean there shouldn't be reprints either. One doesn't preclude the other (in fact, I think they bolster each other).

Chris

Lew Stringer · Post by **Lew Stringer** » 28 Sep 2006, 13:09

chrissmillie wrote:By that token, surely you'd say minor characters from 2000AD (Button Man or Shako) have no appeal, or dated strips like Commando or Classics from the Comics.

There's also who you think the mainstream market is. Kids? Not for 2000AD, Marvel etc. Most of them are in their 30s.

And I'll say again, there are masses of new comics produced. Doesn't mean there shouldn't be reprints either. One doesn't preclude the other (in fact, I think they bolster each other).

Chris

The 2000 AD and Marvel characters appeal to a completely different market than old Scream or Victor strips. Yes, there is a proven market for Dredd etc (although it's not as large as one might think).

I'm not against reprint books. Far from it, as DC Showcase is on my must-buy list every month and I'll be buying the Dandy Book facsimilie. I'm just being realistic as to what would appeal to the readership. Titan tested the waters with Steel Claw and Spider collections. Did they sell enough to warrant second volumes?

Lew

Cap Haggis · Post by **Cap Haggis** » 28 Sep 2006, 14:07

Yeah I agree (again) with Lew - I also have no objections to a reprint book either , in fact I would probably buy it. There is an adult audience out therel, but thats mostly in direct sales land (not so much in WH Smiths - thats why the "Classics" may sell its aimed at kids and probably bought by adults that read them as kids and now buy it for their children - plus it feaures some existing characters Dennis, Desperate Dan etc so there is brand recognition etc - Commando has the marklet all to itself there nothing else out there inthat mould and again its a brand title that is a cult in the UK) There are as you say masses of new comics produced every month (a ridiculous amount in some cases via direct sales) but very few make money or even break even , they are kept going for a short period by the love for the book (plus as soon as they sell under 2k Diamond, the main distributor ditches them so its doomed) just look at the Direct Sales list figures even certain titles with recognisable high profile characters such as Hulk, Thor , Superman, Catwoman etc sell in small numbers, I jus tthink if they can't make it what chance Starhawk, Wilson etc - But then again, if you believe in it you should go for it you never know and al the best in that venture.

chrissmillie · Post by **chrissmillie** » 28 Sep 2006, 14:33

Yup, direct sales. I think we're getting confused with what the market audience is. I know both Lew and yourself (and Kev) are largely talking about kids discovering these for the first time, whereas I believe both David and myself are targetting the people that bought Charley's War (3000 sold on Amazon alone in the first month) and Dan Dare.

I think it is too early to say whether Titan will be doing more Steel Claw etc (though they did blatantly say the next edition would be Kelly's Eye, so I don't know if that has changed) but Titan are now in the position that Egmont were in with 2000AD. Egmont would only make a few thousand from the TPBs - not enough for a big multinational, whereas Titan were small beer and could survive on this. Now Titan are huge and are probably looking for far larger profit margins.

And whereas Victor strips probably wouldn't sell to 2000AD readers, I think Battle or Action (or a compilation of Moore, Wagner, Grant, Mills, Ezquerra etc strips from Scream, Misty etc) would.

Chris

Cap Haggis · Post by **Cap Haggis** » 28 Sep 2006, 15:24

Well good luck with this Chris, If anyone can make a go of it I 'm sure you can - there may well be a place in the market for this type of work.

Comics UK