This weeks Dandy

[Phoenix]

It's not so much the logo I mind, but the whole style - the fonts, the shapes, the colour scheme, the backgrounds, the pictures, the layout, everything

Well that doesn't seem to leave anything that you do like, swirly. Perhaps you should now look for a niche in the comics market where your perception, allied to your critical incisiveness, will be valued. If you are not successful, maybe you could prepare a mock-up of a new comic, one that would be superior to The Dandy in every way, and then trot round the country in search of an amenable publisher. As a last resort, when all your hopes and dreams have been dashed, and your shoes worn out, you might just sit down and mull over the thought that it is relatively easy to demolish a building but much, much harder to build one.

[felneymike]

That wasn't "you shouldn't criticise it until you can do better", was it? Because anybody who thinks like that is obliged to like "Battlefield Earth". And nobody wants that.

[swirlythingy]

Well that doesn't seem to leave anything that you do like, swirly.

I probably shouldn't rise to such an obvious troll, but one of the more basic facts missing from this screed is that I have already expressed the opinion that the Dandy had a perfectly good cover design. It was the old one.

Those on this forum who scream "EVERYTHING ABOUT EVERY BRITISH COMIC PUBLISHED TODAY IS ONE HUNDRED PERCENT PERFECT SO THERE", and there are quite a few of them, are doing far more long-term damage to the industry than I ever could.

[Digifiend]

I wonder what Nigel thinks about being called "Can't-park-inson"?

Yeah. Someone ought to ask him what he thinks.

Not quite the reply I was expecting...

[Phoenix]

No, of course not, FM, but to judge from the quotation below, swirly is dismissing the whole of that week's issue of The Dandy. Naturally, different people have different views about aspects of a comic, or anything else for that matter, and are encouraged on this forum to air their views. But swirly is critical of everything, he says so openly, so he is effectively trashing that entire issue. I am surprised that nobody has so far supported my view, especially people involved in the production of the comic. Look again at what he says.

It's not so much the logo I mind, but the whole style - the fonts, the shapes, the colour scheme, the backgrounds, the pictures, the layout, everything

[Digifiend]

Pretty sure he meant "the whole style..." of the cover.

[Phoenix]

Those on this forum who scream "EVERYTHING ABOUT EVERY BRITISH COMIC PUBLISHED TODAY IS ONE HUNDRED PERCENT PERFECT SO THERE", and there are quite a few of them, are doing far more long-term damage to the industry than I ever could.

You seem a bit hysterical here, swirly, what with your capital letters an' all. There may well be somebody who believes that some comic or other is 100% perfect, but I suggest that you are the only one to put forward the opinion that the issue of The Dandy to which you refer is 0% perfect. Furthermore, I'm not sure how these 100%ers that you refer to could possibly do any damage at all to the industry, as you claim.

P.S. In what sense are you using the word troll?

[Lew Stringer]

Those on this forum who scream "EVERYTHING ABOUT EVERY BRITISH COMIC PUBLISHED TODAY IS ONE HUNDRED PERCENT PERFECT SO THERE", and there are quite a few of them, are doing far more long-term damage to the industry than I ever could.

No one on this forum has ever expressed such sentiments. Just because we're not indulging in negative diatribes about the minutiae of Dandy or Beano doesn't mean we think everything in the garden is lovely. You'll be complaining about the shape of the staples next.

I am surprised that nobody has so far supported my view, especially people involved in the production of the comic.

Give us a chance Phoenix. I was doing the weeding, finishing off a Toxic job, then I watched a CSI episode. Now I've read it I not only support your view I applaud it.

[Phoenix]

Give us a chance Phoenix. I was doing the weeding, finishing off a Toxic job, then I watched a CSI episode. Now I've read it I not only support your view I applaud it.

I'm just having to gather myself together here, take a couple of mouthfuls of the vin rouge, and read the previous post again. Yes, it's true, I did read it correctly, Lew Stringer has agreed with something I've said. Halley's Comet must be turning round and coming back, or perhaps I'm in for an uncomfortable encounter with Bellatrix Lestrange in the next hour or so. If not, here's to the next 1400 posts, Lew.

[swirlythingy]

Pretty sure he meant "the whole style..." of the cover.

Digifiend is indeed correct - my post had nothing to do with "the entire issue", but one page out of 44. (Even the back cover hasn't been given the new style.)

But, hey, why spoil a good excuse to post or approvingly quote yet more misrepresentations of my character with the facts, eh, Lew...?

As for Phoenix, based on past good behaviour, and apparently currently poor reading comprehension skills (and the lateness of the hour and day of the week they all date from), I've revised my original conclusion of "troll" to simply "PUI".

[Lew Stringer]

Pretty sure he meant "the whole style..." of the cover.

Digifiend is indeed correct - my post had nothing to do with "the entire issue", but one page out of 44. (Even the back cover hasn't been given the new style.)

But, hey, why spoil a good excuse to post or approvingly quote yet more misrepresentations of my character with the facts, eh, Lew...?

The way your character is represented here is entirely down to you Martin. I don't write your posts.

In this instance you appear to be confusing Phoenix's comments with my own. I knew you were only talking about the cover. However I still agree with Phoenix's general comment about your incessant criticisms. In fact Phoenix's comment could apply to many other "fans" on other forums and websites who seem to devote their online time to tearing down comics that aren't aimed at them.

For what it's worth I preferred the previous cover design too, but they're trying something different now to try and attract new readers. (Almost like a junior Viz in some ways.) The next two issues have brighter images that look more fun. Let's see how it goes.

[Phoenix]

As for Phoenix, based on past good behaviour, and apparently currently poor reading comprehension skills (and the lateness of the hour and day of the week they all date from), I've revised my original conclusion of "troll" to simply "PUI".

Now that you have opened up the poor reading comprehension skills theme, swirly, might I just point you in the general direction of one of your own deficiencies in that area. You have simply not noticed that in my previous post I asked you to explain in what sense you had used the word troll. This is known as selective reading, by the way. Also not only do you not answer my question but you go on to introduce PUI, which is yet another word or expression that means nothing to me. I am now doubly uncertain as to the strength of your criticism of me, for such I take these words or expressions to be. Incidentally, this shows good reading comprehension skills on my part because I'm interpreting words that I don't understand. Furthermore, as I have hitherto been completely unaware that posts were being judged in a good behaviour category, I would appreciate your telling me if this is the result of an edict from on high, at the level of Al no less, that somehow has not passed down the chain of command as far as me, or whether you are taking it upon yourself to be judge, jury and indeed executioner whenever you consider it necessary. A complete reply is respectfully requested, preferably before colcool007 closes this thread down as well.

[big bad bri]

i must be getting old i know what troll means but have never heard the term PUI,what does that mean?

[Phoenix]

Patience, Bri, patience. Swirly will be revealing all shortly.

[swirlythingy]

The way your character is represented here is entirely down to you Martin. I don't write your posts.

In this instance you appear to be confusing Phoenix's comments with my own. I knew you were only talking about the cover. However I still agree with Phoenix's general comment about your incessant criticisms. In fact Phoenix's comment could apply to many other "fans" on other forums and websites who seem to devote their online time to tearing down comics that aren't aimed at them.

The second paragraph is false; ergo, so is the first.

Of course I don't "devote my online time to tearing down comics". I repeat: I was only talking about the cover. I don't think I even mentioned any of the other 43 pages. How can you draw a conclusion about my view of the comic based on that, especially bearing in mind that one of my principal objections was precisely how much the cover wasn't representative of the comic as a whole?

Your view of my posts doesn't apply to any other issues, either. If I don't like something, I'll post about it (if I remember), sure. If I do like something, usually I forget to write about it, unless it's in response to someone else posting about it. The reason for this is, apart from the obvious problems of holding up a placard reading "Keep things as they are!", is simply because the things I don't like are the exception. If I was to write about all the things I approved of, every week, I'd probably overflow the forum database with 60000-character descriptions of 60-odd pages every week (more in school holidays). Even some things I don't like, I tend not to complain about because I can see they're necessary, or appreciate as a matter of taste, such as subscription ads, the type of humour in a particular strip or a given art style.

And bearing all this in mind, it's still not terribly difficult to find posts by me praising aspects of an issue. Admittedly you tend not to reply to those.

Now for the paragraph you always ignore: I honestly believe that both comics are measurably better than they were one year ago, and considerably so at that. The Dandy's obviously had its revamp, but even the Beano, which has been plodding uphill steadily, has reached the point where it can look down to the altitude it was at a year ago and get a sudden attack of vertigo. Incidentally, I said the same thing six months ago. But it's quite difficult to spot the small, incremental improvements at the time they're made, which is why I often miss them until a few weeks later when I suddenly realise something's missing. By that point it's generally too late to post without attracting puzzled looks. Dennis's stealth reversion is a neat example of this.

In summary, generally speaking I complain instantly, and praise in retrospect. You, on the other hand, tend to do the exact opposite (for example, spending three years defending Dandy Xtreme, but rightly heralding the revamp as a massive improvement), so perhaps it's no surprise we rarely agree.

For what it's worth I preferred the previous cover design too, but they're trying something different now to try and attract new readers. (Almost like a junior Viz in some ways.) The next two issues have brighter images that look more fun. Let's see how it goes.

Viz was the first thing which struck me, too - mostly in the fonts used and position of the masthead.

For the record, the only staple-related complaint I've ever had was back in the Beano's toilet paper years, when one or both were frequently missing.

As for Phoenix, I'm just going to ignore him now. He can't still be drunk, but he's definitely acting out of character and seems immune to reason. In arguments with such people, everyone, especially the rest of the beleaguered users of this forum, can only lose.